STATter911.com’s previous coverage of this story
Russell Dawson admits, “It has not been a pleasant time to be chief”. Chief Dawson and the Rockville Volunteer Fire Department heard twice in two days last week from the Rockville Police Department that firefighters were found in places where they shouldn’t have been.
The most serious incident was around 1:00 Friday morning at the Montgomery County Fire & Rescue Service logistics and supply building on Dover Road. Chief Dawson tells STATter911.com it was quite a shock to learn that three 17-year-old probationary members were arrested. They were charged with breaking into the building and attempting to steal firefighter gear.
Dawson is asking the public not to judge the more than 200 volunteer members of the department by “the actions of these three”. But two other members remain in hot water for an incident that happened earlier in the week.
Police were called Tuesday to a party room at the Fenestra Apartments across the street from the Station 3. Dawson says one of Rockville’s volunteer firefighters lives in the apartments and had been hosting get-togethers with fellow firefighters inside the room in recent months. According to Dawson, these events are done off-duty on the firefighters’ own time.
The chief says apartment management had recently started shutting the room down at 10:00 PM. The fire department’s investigation has determined that seven of the nine firefighters didn’t know about the new rules and that entry was made into the locked room before their arrival. The suspensions of the seven have been lifted.
Chief Dawson says the firefighter who lives in the building and another volunteer, who is believed to have forced open the locked door, are still facing a disciplinary hearing.
Chief Dawson is concerned because of incidents involving “a few rogue people” the public will get the wrong impression about the Rockville Volunteer Fire Department. He says the volunteers provided more than 140,000 hours of standby-duty last year ready to respond to emergencies.
Also on STATter911 …
- Neighbors say Flint, Michigan firefighters missed body. Woman found 12-hours after fire. – April 18, 2011
- UPDATE: Firefighters turn their DCFD emblazoned backs on Chief Kenneth Ellerbe. Reporter says more than 100 walk out of State of DC Fire & EMS address. – January 24, 2012
- Guest column: Lawyer/former firefighter tackles the trooper vs. news photographer video. – December 12, 2010
- Montgomery County takes over Burtonsville VFD. Cites sex, public urination & safety concerns at MD firehouse. Volunteers call it retaliation over ambulance fee fight. – March 1, 2011
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sounds like dunkirk has migrated to moco now!
Let the bashing begin.
I wonder if any of them were being credited for volunteer time while out breaking and entering.
Here we go again!! Its funny how this went from bashing the Volies then the paid then PG. Why don’t we beat on Fairfax for awhile then we can do PA.
I knew that it wouldn’t take very long to find a reason to put them back on the roster but even I am suprised by how quickly they managed to dodge their suspension.
We don’t bash wanna-be’s from PA because it is like shooting fish in a barrel….It is way to easy and isn’t fun anymore.
Another reason, as a tax payer, I don’t think there should be volunteer firefighters in Montgomery County. I pay taxes for professional firefighters not to support a clown show like this.
Please don’t misunderstand how these “wanna-be’s from Pa” get down to MD. When we here in PA recognize a firefighter as a wing-ding, goofball, 8 ball, stroker, whacker, yard breather, or other mentally challenged individual, we send them where they’ll with more of their own kind….Maryland. And remember, when we in the North flush our toilets, it eventually winds up South…..thats right, MAryland. And to think, we never get even get the common courtesy of a thank you. Thats gratitude fer ya.
Hey Taxpayer. Move to D.C. You will find one good show after another everyday. And you call that professional???????? What a joke!!!
You need to inform all of your neighbors, friends, co – workers etc… the same. There is absolutely NO NEED to “donate” any money at all to these clowns. It is bad enough that the career staff of MCFRS who runs 95%ish of the calls in the county are thought of as volunteers anyway. Residents, your tax dollars pay for ALL of your fire / rescue needs!
Rusty Trombone, Executive Director / FFII Mega Badge and the Troll are all jokes; everyone knows it but does nothing!
Sure the career side has issues, but they are dealt with. You vfders can throw plenty of stones but none of those people are still in an active status with the career side. And do not give me that business about saving money and being equally trained. How many credit hours do you need to be a volunteer Lt., Capt., or B/C? That is what I thought. How many years as a vfd FFIII do you need to be blessed as a vfd Master Firefighter? Hell, you do not even need to be a driver to be a vfd Master Firefighter! You are not equal to the career side and never will be.
How long does a vfd driver get an NATD status for wrecking a piece of County owned fire apparatus? Not too long I guess considering the same person has had several incidents with AT703 in the past 4 months. EQUAL MY HINDESIDE!!!!!
YEA, YEA, I know, I knew what I was getting into when I took the job. Too bad those days are long gone along with the quality (not quantity) of volunteers.
“I know I just broke the law, but I’m a volunteer firefighter. Didn’t anyone tell you?, we are allowed to break the law and get away with it. Volunteers save the government millions and gazillions of dollars everyday, blah, blah blah… Maybe I’ll just go rob a bank or burn down an abandoned building, or better yet bring my girlfriend over and let her piss on one of the career guys.” MCFRS, put your foot down and get rid of these worthless ticks.
I just hope that after the police/criminal investigation that the department (MCFRS)will discipline them as they would a career person after all we are one department
My guess is all of them will be forgiven and promoted up the volunteer chain.I guess because they are volunteers they shoild be allowed to break the law and get away with it.
The so called “PROFESSIONALS” are the joke in Montgomery County. The guys in the Glenmont/Leisure World area who think they are special, can’t put out a garden apartment fire to save their lives. How about that coward Batallion Chief who said over the radio to abandon the two civilians thought be in that house fire in Bethesda. I wont even bring up the UP-County huddle.
I have noticed in the paper problems with career firefighters, but I always hear about them retiring (forced I’m guessing) or no longer being with the department. What about Burtonsville? What happened to that firefighter? Is it true there are volunteers living in the fire house as a home?!?!? Who pays the gas, water, electric and cable they are using?!? Am I? Is it maybe the new Chief of the department is too volunteer happy? Thankfully the station where I live is staffed with paid firefighters 24/7/365. Thanks for what you guys do!
Taxpayer Then move your dumb self there. You would not make a pimple on a Voolies Butt. Get help for your retardation!!!!!!!!!!
Mr Taxpayer: One figure that no one can dispute is that the volunteer fire service is saving the taxpayer about 40-50 million a year. You want to pay for it? For that 40-50 million you won’t get any better fire suppression or EMS service delivery by the conversion to a fully paid Department. That I Guarantee.
Are you questioning who pay for the gas, water, electric and cable? I would say or call you something, but Dave isn’t about that. When the volunteer live in’s at at a fire station are not there, who do you think works on the fire apparatus. Yep, all the career fireman respond from their homes to get the fire apparatus out (that way they can save the County money on the cable bills) LMAO.
Half the guys that are career were also brought up in the volunteer system. They were educated in that same system that everyone wants to bash. Some forgot where they came from. Some became indocrinated by the union thing. But most are highly trained and knew what they were getting into when they took the job and stay out of the bs. The point here, is the current leadership of the Rockville Fire Dept has failed provide the leadership it used to have with its younger members.
Anonymous are you serious about your post to Mr. Taxpayer??? No one can dispute the volunteer fire service is saving the taxpayer 40-50 million a year??? Seriously, I think you have took one too many sips of the “We save taxpayer money” koolaid…If you honestly believe that is a valid statistic, then by all mean please provide some evidence or documentation. Not saying the career side is perfect, but come on!!! Forcing a door is breaking and entering, plain and simple….And if the volunteers save sooo much money, then why are the Volunteer Chief, and Executive Director of the Volunteer Asscociation PAID by the county????? How does that qualify them as volunteer then? Taxpayer, you want to see how much they “save”? Check into how much they COST first. Kinda hypocrytical to say you are a volunteer while collecting a check from the County for your service!!!!
First question is there is a “paid” volunteer Chief? Was he promoted via the ranks just like any other chief within the department? Second confusing question is why do the volunteers have a union? Do the volunteers have to pay annual dues to this union or is it something they are given for free as well. Anothernobody I strongly agree with what you said. There is no way having volunteers within this county saves, me as a taxpayer, 40-50 million dollars. If those are corrected numbers please raise my taxes another $40 a year. That would be correct right? With about a million residents living in MoCo. And Mr. Man, speaking of retardation, I never said anything about moving. At least your fellow volunteer speaks with some respect.
TaxPayer…here are a few sites to check out and sections to read
http://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/content/omb/FY10/psprec/PDFs/frs.pdf
Page 6 of 11, FY09 cost, 7.6 million, FY10 recommended 6.25million…Note nominal fee cost of $304,290 for “Nominal Fee”
http://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/content/firerescue/dovs/ql/docs/VolunteerContract09-11.pdf
Page 3 Section Three. The County will provide $5000 in each year of the contract for an annual
awards ceremony for the volunteers each April of the contract. The Association and fire chief will agree on a venue, forum and list of recognitions. 19LVFD- $95,000 per year for the volunteers banquet
Mont. Co. Comprehensive financial report FY09 page 190 of 123
4) Length of Service Award Program (LOSAP)
Under Section 21-21 of the Montgomery County Code, the County has established a Length of Service Award Program (LOSAP) for the County’s Department of Fire and Rescue Service volunteers who meet certain age and service criteria. Benefit expenditures amounting to $1,137,186 in FY09 also include disability and survivor annuities and lump-sum death benefits, and are reported in the Fire Tax District Special Revenue Fund on a “pay-as-you-go” basis. There were 470 recipients comprising former volunteers and their beneficiaries at the end of FY09. Based on the latest available valuation,
the unfunded actuarial accrued liability for the LOSAP plan is $20,740,159.
As far as the Volunteers being back at firehouse already…The Chief should keep them out …Page 4 Section Three. Procedure for Notifying the Fire Chief of Alleged Misconduct
1. Each LFRD President or designee shall immediately notify the Fire Chief or designee of any alleged serious violation. A serious violation involves a threat to the public or personnel safety, or undermines the public trust
and confidence in the fire and rescue service. A serious violation includes an egregious: negligent act or omission; theft of property; felony; assault; battery; or other violation of law, County policy, MCFRS policy or any
lawful order of the Fire Chief. Notwithstanding Section 3(a)(2) below, the Fire Chief may proceed with disciplinary action directly against the individual(s) in question consistent with section 21-3(g) of the County Code.
Page 13,14 – Article 12. NOMINAL FEE
An active volunteer as defined in Section 21-21 (a) of the Montgomery County Code
shall receive either:
(1) a nominal fee of: three hundred ($300.00) dollars July 1, 2009; four hundred
($400.00) dollars July 1, 2010;
OR
(2) a nominal fee of: five hundred ($500.00) dollars July 1, 2009; six hundred
($600.00) dollars July 1, 2010; if the active volunteer:
- 14 -
(a) is on the Integrated Emergency Command Structure (IECS) certified list; and
(b) received the maximum allowable Length of Service Awards Program (LOSAP)
points for department or station responses as specified in Section 21-21(k)(6) of the
Montgomery County Code in the previous calendar year; and
(c) received the maximum allowable LOSAP points for sleep-in or stand-by as specified
in Section 21-21(k)(3) of the Montgomery County Code in the previous calendar year.
In addition, the appropriate LFRD President must certify in writing that the volunteer has
met the requirements set forth in section one, subsections (a) through (c) of this article.
Page 20– FY10 Operating Budget worksession, Notice on page 20 how the Volunteers agree with elimination of all of the Career positions even in administration, but the administrative position for the Volunteers was fought like crazy• Lapse Manager III (Volunteer Services – FY09 Savings Plan)
http://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/content/council/pdf/agenda/cm/2009/090424/20090424_PS03.pdfpage 4 of 54…..The “second in command” Manager III for Volunteer services is paid $123,495 dollars per year….with OSC for Volunteer services making $68,610-$ 89,580 per year
So yes, they are a bunch of PAID “Volunteers”. The executive director and Volunteer Fire Chief are paid as well, and NO the Chief doesn’t come up through the ranks and require the SAME training as the Career Chief. In fact, none of the volunteers require the SAME training the career people do to hold their positions. It’s alot to read, but people should be informed of what they are “PAYING” for
AnotherNobody. Great Job. You are very up on it all. More are needed like you. Thanks.
paid or volunteer….who cares! They broke the law and should be punished. The persons involved broke into a private building to use for recreation and who knows what else. Others broke into a county building with county/ federal property and were CAUGHT IN THE ACT OF STEALING IT by using knox box keys. If this is swept under the rug, then what next? Can I take a rescue squad home as a take home car? Both sides have black eyes from past events but with the lack of holding people responsible for their actions, where will it end? As a career member, Im sure I would be looking in the want ads right about now; so Im just curious as to what is going to happen to them and when all the bullsh** is going to end. I dont have all the solutions, but we can all make solutions to our own problems. Look in the mirror, think about what you are about to do and then consider the consequences. If you have to stop to think about what are doing to think that you may get in trouble if caught, then dont do it! As always a few members are giving both sides a bad rep from their own actions….
The so called “PROFESSIONALS” are the joke in Montgomery County. The guys in the Glenmont/Leisure World area who think they are special, can’t put out a garden apartment fire to save their lives. How about that coward Batallion Chief who said over the radio to abandon the two civilians thought be in that house fire in Bethesda. I wont even bring up the UP-County huddle. I Live in MoCo and I’m glad there are volunteers.
Anonymous…were you even at the Bethesda fire?? I doubt it, because there was no confirmation of the people being trapped and the Batt. Chief said if there were anyone inside the structure, they were dead…remember risk assessment?? Ever heard of it?? Risk a little to save a little, risk alot to save alot….Even if there was anyone inside(which there wasnt), It would have been a body recovery…So what should have been done? Run inside anyway like the 355 fire where the “VOLUNTEER” fell through the floor and almost died being a “Hero”??? He almost killed himself by being a cowboy…There is nothing wrong with being an aggressive firemen, everyone should strive to be that in my opinion, but your statements are ridiculous. Oh, and the garden apartment fire at Leisure World…which one are you talking about??? The one from a few years back? or the recent fire on Georgia Ave? Seems like the “volunteer” contingent on here have nothing but smack talk…No numbers, stats, or even TRUE stories that they were a part of…You seem awful tough online, probably a yardbreather in real life
Volunteers are a drain on Montgomery County Taxpayers. They are not saving you any money what-so-ever. They are not held to the same standards, not held accountable for their actions. Career Fireman face serious disciplinary actions and penalties for poor judgement and behaviors. There are those career personnel who fall through the cracks, but no system is perfect. Citizens should not give any money to these so called volunteer “firefighters”, your tax dollars provide a blanket of protection for you. There are many citizens in Montgomery County who are under the false impression that because a Fire Engine says “volunteer” on the side of it, volunteers are staffing it. WRONG!!!! The overwhelming majority of the time it is paid firefighters. There is no option for career firemen to fail or “scratch” on calls. This happens all the time at places like Laytonsville, Olney-Sandy Spring, Wheaton etc.. These places “downstaff” in the evening and if there are no volunteers to take their place, the paid staff try and pick up the slack, cross-staffing all pieces. The taxpayers in these places or anywhere else should not be afforded less protection because the volunteers don’t show up as promised by their volunteer “Chiefs”. The volunteer system should be eliminated as a whole and that money re-allocated to the paid staff.
Concerned Citizen is just talking his paid mumble Jumble. He must be out of sta. 35.Sorry to say the Vollies are here to stay and do a much better job that your geek squad where you work. You should spend a little more time learning your job than whining like a grade school girl!! If it were not for the Vollies you would not have a job. Grow up and man up!!
Bravo Concerned Citizen. You are exactly correct in your statement. There are areas in the US where volunteers are needed but not in an urbanized area such as Montgomery County. They are a drain on valuable funds. The idea that they save money is a myth. They just want to pound their chests and say look at us.
As a volunteer in Montgomery County for over 12 years, I have to say that RVFD should be embarrassed and angry over this sitatuion. While I know this most likely won’t happen, but RVFD needs to expell these member and MCFRS should not allow them to join another department. As for the other comments, I think the career and volunteer bashing is inappropriate and everyone who wants to make this out to be a career vs. volunteer issue should realize it isn’t one. The “kids” should be kicked out, RVFD should be disciplined by the fire chief – let’s move on. I believe in one system, but at the rate we are attacking each other we will never be one. I know we are compensated volunteers but that does not mean we are any less than career staffing. I think concerned citizen and taxpayer should come and live a day in my shoes – I work full time, have a family and I dedicate a night a week to my LFRD. I know that doesn’t sound like much, but I love my job and I’m proud of the job I do at my department. No, I do not feel entitled to break and enter into logistics nor do I feel like I am allowed to break the law. I’m a firefighter and proud of it – and I would never engage in behavior that would reflect poorly on my department or MCFRS as a whole. I think everyone should take a hint – there is at least one respectful and law abiding volunteer member in MCFRS.
I’ll agree that most volunteers are dedicated, but the problem is that they won’t admit that they need help in staffing the units sometimes. I was a volunteer in a local jurisdiction and can remember the Chief telling the 3 man paid shift to get the Engine and Truck out with 3 people no matter what,so that they would not scratch on the call. There are bad apples on both sides, career and volunteer and they need to be dealt with. If the units can’t get out the door, then there needs be career staffing. This is especially true in Prince Georges County. Its time to quit playing games with people’s lives and also the firefighters’ lives.
Look, I am not “Volunteer Bashing”..I think there are bad apples on both side…The “pedifile” on Career side should have his N_ts cut off…”Would you like to buy a vowel???” He just retired, the “alleged arsonist” should be locked away and the key thrown away…..I mean seriously, for a fireman to set fires is to a cop to rob a bank…It’s like…well, it’s like a “VOLUNTEER” getting a paycheck…it just isnt right and those people (wont even call them firemen) should be sent to away forever…I am not saying Vollies aren’t educated, just saying they DO NOT have the same training as Career Guys and if this was a group of Career Personnel this happened to, they would be on the outside looking in…NO WAY would they be “back to work” already…that’s a fact!!!!! They would be looking for a new “career”…AND it kills me to see a volunteer saying they “save” the county 40-50 million dollars a year on this site, there are people that have no clue reading this website that might actually beilieve that number….GOD help them!!!!!
after knowing a retired firefighter, I’ll be darned if I will donate to any fund for the fire fighters widows or whatever, the retiree I am talking about gets over $2000.00 A MONTH IN RETIREMENT AND A GREAT MEDICAL PLAN, ALSO AFTER A FEW DRINKS WE HEAR ABOUT THE ITEMS HE STOLE FROM THE HOMES HE WAS IN …TO PUT OUT A FIRE…. I DON’T THINK THE PUBLIC KNOWS HALF OF WHAT GOES ON WITH SOME OF THESE GUYS, also most of them eat FREE at restaurants, after work they go home and change into a clean uniform to get free meals,